• Do not use Discord to host any images you post, these links expire quickly! You can learn how to add images to your posts here.
  • Eevee Expo's webhost has been having technical issues since Nov. 20th and you might be unable to connect to our site. Staff are also facing issues connecting, so please send a DM to Cat on-site or through Discord directly for faster service!

Cities

Jayrodd

Professional Hot Pepper
Member
Joined
Jan 7, 2016
Posts
22
Cities (and towns, etc) play a one of the biggest roles in pokemon for how little we consider them. They are your hub for the adventure, or your next destination as you travel, but they always have something unique about them. Some of these locations even have rich lore behind them and the people you meet there.

  • Discuss what can make a city design unique and successful in the pokemon world
  • Provide tricks to making one of these areas feel more organic for your own games
  • Share your favorite city and what you enjoy about it
 

Dragonite

Have they found the One Piece yet?
Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2017
Posts
204
Discuss what can make a city design unique and successful in the pokemon world

This is very vague but if I can remember a city's name a month after playing the game for the first time without having to look it up, there must be something memorable about it. Either that or the game just says its name five hundred thousand times. Maybe I should re-think this criteria.

Memorable places:
- Geosenge
- Lumiose
- Sootopolis
Un-memorable places:
- Konikoni
- Accumula
- Mahogany (don't laugh)

It's possible to be memorable for bad reasons, though, which leads into

Provide tricks to making one of these areas feel more organic for your own games

Unfortunately, this I do not have. One strategy is to just make it freaking enormous and try and keep it as interesting as possible, but anyone who's tried making a map or maybe been to Lumiose knows this isn't necessarily a good idea. Something else that works is taking a geological (or maybe man-made) feature and making something that can only exist with the help of said feature, like Sootopolis inside the volcano or . . . I guess Sootopolis is the only really good example of this in Pokémon games, unless you count Pacifidlog, although I also like to cite the city of Solitude from Skyrim when discussing these sorts of things. Needless to say, to expect to be able to bang out something unique like that every time is like expecting to get an A on every paper between first grade and graduate school so there should probably be at least a few backup solutions.

Edit: oh yeah, Fortree exists. That was pretty cool. Hoenn did a pretty good job with cities overall.

Share your favorite city and what you enjoy about it

Haven't I talked about it enough? Sootopolis.
 
Last edited:

Taq

Sandwich Master
Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2017
Posts
93
I think a city design can be good if it has a unique look to it or takes advantage of the inspiration.

I think a strategy to making a good town it making it orientated on something, like maybe making it all on a tree, or have it all be stalactites like from avatar.

My favorite city was... Actually Idk to be honest.
Maybe fortree because it was more creativity then accuracy. Or Tapu Villiage more being so barren and take advantage of it's inspiration.​
 
City designs, let's get to it!

I think I've talked about this a fair bit about the Zelda botw towns, but I believe for a town to be outstanding and unique is that is has to have a culture/story of a sort. If you create a story behind the city/town/whatever the physical features that set the town apart tend to think up themselves. For example... If you create a town with a very heavy religious background it will have a church and the houses might have religious decorations, giving the town a uniqueness in story and physicality. Another example, if a town constantly ruined by floods, the town might have levees (I think that is what they are called) to protect them and a few ruined areas that haven't been cleaned up yet. It's just my opinion, but I believe a town needs lore of some sort to be used to its full potential.

Now, onto a bit of a controversial point of mine...
Both the posts above mine have mentioned how Fortree city was pretty cool, and yeah, it was pretty cool, but I feel like it wasn't used properly. I've only played ORAS, so maybe in the originals they go into more depth with the town, but to me it just seemed cool in looks, you don't really do anything significant in it. In geosenge town it is memorable because at first it appears as a mystery stone hendge, but then BOOM! A massive weapon of destruction is awakened and you have to stop it. All Fortree city had was a gym and some ladders to climb, I think they should have done more with it.

My favourite town in a Pokemon game would have to be... I'm not too sure, I don't really have one, but some ones I do like are Mossdeep city, Geosenge, Castelia, New Mauvile.

But if we are leaving the realm of Pokemon, my favourite town would be Solitude from Skyrim, or maybe even Radiant Garden from Kingdom hearts, probably some other cool towns from other games that I am forgetting.
 

Hematite

Trainer
Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2017
Posts
55
The first thing I want to cover is size!

I think a good range is 4 to 10 unique, enterable buildings for the absolute smallest and biggest towns/cities in the region, unless it's something that really warrants an exception, like Lumiose where you access different segments at different parts of the game (although even that was way overdone!). As a player who likes to try to talk to every NPC/enter every building, this is nice because it stays fun and enjoyable rather than becoming a tedious chore to explore.

There are ways other than making a lot of buildings to keep a city feeling big - for example, Nimbasa City in B2W2 has ten buildings, Pokémon Center and both Gyms included (eleven if the Ferris Wheel counts, but it's not something you walk around in like the rest). Even so, they're spaced apart really effectively to convey the feeling of a big city.

> First, Nimbasa is split cleanly into sections: the main city with the Pokémon Center, three buildings and the Battle Subway; the amusement park with two Gyms; and the straight street to the north with the three biggest buildings. I really liked this, because it spaced everything out enough not to feel cramped, and you knew where things were, and the aesthetic had a ton of character.

> The second thing is that, from an in-world perspective, all of those sections are very logical, which gives the city character, shows how and why things are there, and makes it easy to remember where things are. The amusement park has the old Gym, which is a rollercoaster, and a Ferris Wheel, and then in B2W2 the second Gym was added there because that's where the old Gym was, so it's logical from an in-world perspective. Meanwhile, on the straight street, the three buildings are for sports and musicals; people go there to spectate events. Finally, the residential areas and Pokémon Center are all placed together in the inner city, and the subway station is near the houses for convenience.

> Even though the amusement park only had two of Nimbasa's buildings, the NPCs there, the Pokémon balloons and the general aesthetic did just enough to capture the feeling of an amusement park and feel like its own place. Your cities will feel samey and bland if you only rely on buildings to cover the bare minimum; you should have unique points of interest that aren't buildings and a distinct aesthetic, theme and purpose for everything if you want your city to feel alive.

> You actually also had to go to every part of the city and pass everything by at some point, so it didn't feel like you were going way off-course and making an unnecessary trip if you decided to explore; it was already where you were going. You enter from the south, sure, but then you have the Gym in the amusement park so you have to go there (also N in BW), the Pokémon Center in the bottom left corner so you have to go there, the Battle Subway right in between those so you have to pass it by, the Pokémon Musical building had Bianca's story event in BW and the middle of that street had a Plasma fight in B2W2, and that itself was on the right side of the street so you had to pass through the whole street to get to the exit on the left. There was no part of the city you didn't have reason to touch in-game.

So going off of Nimbasa, if you want your city to feel big but still alive, and you want players to enjoy exploring every nook and cranny, you have to divide it up cleanly and organize it well so players always have a point of reference and won't get lost, you have to pay attention to the themes and aesthetics of every part of it instead of making it all look the same, and if you really want it to flow naturally and to make players see it all, you should design it so they actually have to touch every part of the city at some point - entering the buildings can be optional, obviously, but seeing them from the outside is important and an entire row of buildings shouldn't be possible to completely miss!

Another thing: I don't really like doorless buildings that only exist to take up space. Actually, while we're using Unova as an example... Opelucid City is designed as a version-exclusive, and it just happens that one version shows what I like and one shows what I don't! In all versions, there are seven enterable buildings in Opelucid City. Beyond this, there exists in all versions a grid of buildings surrounding the city that serve to extend the background.

In White and White 2, this grid is entirely cut off anyway - there are trees, bushes and such that keep you from reaching any of these buildings to begin with, so it's conceivable that people live in them and you just can't reach them - they're not a part of your adventure, but they could still be a part of the world. Throughout Opelucid in these versions, there are also more trees and some elevation changes to guide you along a designated path - trees and elevation changes. These fit well with the world and keep you where you're supposed to go without taking you out of the experience and making you think "wait, why is this here?"

In Black and Black 2, you actually can reach a hecking ton of doorless buildings. Of that grid I mentioned: in the White version of the city, all four sides are cut off anyway, but in the Black version, you can touch one of the buildings specifically from that grid on the left side and all of them on the right side, making you wonder why you can't enter them. EDIT: Correction! Actually, that grid is inaccessible in both versions. I was looking at a low-quality map and didn't notice the gate on those sides, sorry!!! And beyond that grid that's in both versions, there are a further six buildings that are used solely as blocks and, again, have no doors or function in the world. It's significantly more immersion-breaking than in the White version, because while the White version skillfully arranged natural roadblocks that fit in and made sense to keep you from reaching that outer grid, the Black version has two sides of the grid and a further six buildings that are fully possible to reach and touch and should by all means be interactable because they would logically serve a purpose in the world if they were constructed, but they have no doors and... well, no, serve no purpose in the world. XP

To put that in perspective, in both the Black and White versions of Opelucid City, there are seven buildings you can enter; in the White version, there are some doorless buildings, but the player cannot reach them and they're not awkwardly placed; and yet, in the Black version only, there are eleven EDIT: nope, still six - see above! Six is still a lot worse than the zero in White/White 2, though, haha doorless buildings that the player can reach and touch and that serve no purpose in the world. I think that the White version of Opelucid City handled them just right - you could see them and they made the city feel bigger, but you couldn't reach them and they didn't break immersion while the city was big enough with the seven buildings you could reach. I think what's most important here is that, as a player, I feel like the White version of the city felt bigger because of the unreachable doorless buildings, but the Black version felt smaller because of the reachable doorless buildings - in White, it felt like I had access to everything I needed and I could reach everything in that part of Opelucid that I could reach, while in Black, even with the same enterable buildings, the doorless ones were too intrusive and I felt like I was being robbed, whether of space that could be used for walking or of buildings that could have been enterable but weren't.
 
Last edited:

aiyinsi

A wild Minun appeared!
Member
Joined
May 17, 2017
Posts
256
I think it's fine as long a city has a theme. This theme should be only used once in the region though. As long as the theme is new a city is always something that feels new when you explore it.

Also every city should have a reason for that theme if it's special. For example: Fortree city is on trees because the people love nature, Rustboro city is big because of Devon Corporation, ...

Also the NPCs should act according to the cities theme(Fortree has NPCs talking about nature and bug Pokémon, Rustboro a lot of workers).

Another thing that makes citys memorable in the main series is the music. It supports the feel of the city, too. Like a big city having a busy theme and a little village having a relaxing theme.
Just hearing the song of Littleroot Town will automaticly make me feel nostalgic. That's the reason why I don't really like fangame citys to have another towns music. Although I know that most of the game devs cannot compose and therefore have to use music from somewhere else.

If there is a story event the city will be more memorable than if there is not. For example a gym, evil team base, rival encounter,...
The length of events happening should be proportional to the size of the city. With length I mean the time from all events added together. This will small cities feel smaller and big cities feel bigger. It also helps the player orientate in big cities.

My favorite city ... that's though ... I like Slateport City a lot. Just because of its holiday feeling with the big beach, the market and the lighthouse.
 

Djaco75

MasterMind
Member
Joined
Apr 19, 2017
Posts
122
I've been waiting for this one! I love cities, especially big and complex ones!

I really admire cities like Jubilife and Hearthome in Sinnoh because of their complexity but their simplicity and uniformity at the same time. I think the tiles used in these cities are exemplary and really suit the city's purpose.

Leading on from this, I feel like the key to making a good city is an adventure. Don't make the city boring or too small, rather exciting and adventurous. Have little small lanes and pathways for exploration and things that promote the player to move around.

Personally, my favourite city is Anistar City in Kalos. I like the design behind it and the complexity, but especially the huge purple structure (I think it's an hourglass) that must have taken ages to create. I feel like this has all the components of a good city: complexity, creativity and adventure!
 
Back
Top